6mm arc vs 6mm creedmoor 6mm arc vs 6mm creedmoor

John Snows article for Outdoor Life was used as a reference for the history of the 6mm Creedmoor. To my way of thinking, we are splitting hairs ballistically, and as always the shooter will make all the difference. It is also about the same size as a BB pellet. The Creedmoor will typically penetrate deeper and create a wider wound channel than the 9mm ARC, making it a better choice for hunting. The 6.5 Creedmoor commonly uses 120gr, 140gr, and 143gr bullets. The 6mm, refers to the bore diameter of the barrel, more specifically actually a .243 or 6mm bullet diameter. The differences in trajectory are of course smaller at shorter ranges, but that 200fps advantage in muzzle velocity the 6mm Creedmoor has does result in a noticeable improvement in performance. Take that for what you will, but no animal will be able to tell the difference between an additional 100-200 ft-lbs of energy with a well placed bullet though. 224 Valkyrie. Out of the same barrel length, 18 inches, the 6mm ARC is claimed to be capable of shooting a 108gr ELD Match bullet with a very slightly lower .270 G7 BC at a slightly faster 2630fps. The only way that works is if his arc barrel is very fast and the creed is super slow and loaded light, similar pressures the creed will outperform the arc every time now the arc will be more efficient. Barrel life variable depend on your rifle, barrel, load, velocity and bullet. Cartridge Specs: 6.5 Creedmoor Vs. 6mm Creedmoor Understanding a cartridge's capabilities always begins with basic knowledge of the physical properties of the cartridge. My first concern about possibly switching is the 300ft/lbs lower energy of the 6mm ARC. On the other hand, 6mm Creedmoor rifles usually have a faster rifling twist (1:7.7 in the case of the Ruger Precision Rifle), so the cartridge is commonly available with 103 grain, 105 grain, 107 grain, 108 grain, and 112 grain bullets. The Eagle Eye 6.5 Creedmoor shoots a 130gr hybrid projectile with a .295 G7 at 2,960fps from an average 26" barrel. The Creedmoor has about 17% more recoil than the ARC, so it is a bit more punishing to shoot. The 6.5 Creedmoor has a slightly larger bullet than the 6mm ARC, and that extra size makes a big difference in terminal performance. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); To re-barrel or chamber a rifle to a difference caliber or cartridge, it is important to know if the bolt face will work with the new case head diameter. For instance, most .243 Winchester loads top out at 100 grains and few .243 rifles have a fast enough twist rate (1:9 and 1:10 are very common) to stabilize bullets heavier than that. According to this data that seems possible. Like the .243 Winchester, the 6mm Creedmoor is also a really good varmint as well as big game hunting cartridge. In addition, it comes with a two-year warranty from HORI one of the longest warranties in the business. Photo by Michael Anschuetz. Lastly, I am . Felt recoil will vary from shooter to shooter and rifle to rifle, but free recoil energy is still a useful way to compare cartridges. However a 300WM will always beat a 308 given the same barrel length. So, take all that for what you will. Id guess its tied to the myth that bigger cartridges need more barrel length. As a follow-up exercise, I plan to use QuickDesign software to create a more accurate model for the 6mm . In general, the bigger the bullet, the better it will perform on game animals. So although John Snow from Outdoor Life magazine and website has claimed that it was his idea as early as 2007 but that they only made such a rifle later in 2009 for an article that appeared in the magazine in 2010 (earliest mention I can find of an Outdoor Life magazine that contains an article of a 6mm Creedmoor is of the Aug 2011 issue), that cannot be verified, so we will officially going with Mr Lee Gardner as the first documented person to think of the idea of the 6mm Creedmoor. A few years later, Gardner was brainstorming ideas on how to gain an advantage in the new Precision Rifle Series competition (PRS) that was rapidly growing in popularity and remembered the project hed worked on with Snow. The chart below compares how much a 10 mile per hour crosswind impacts those same loads for each cartridge out to 500 yards. The 6mm ARC offers a 30 to 35% lighter-weight package (gun and ammo). In general, larger calibers are better at delivering more energy to the target and creating a bigger wound channel, while smaller calibers are lighter and easier to carry. With barrels of equal lengths and a 200-yard zero, the 6.5 ELD Match bullet drops 6 inches more at 500 yards than the 6mm ELD Match. Regardless of how well a given person handles recoil, all other things being equal, they will absolutely shoot better with a milder recoil. Hornady's new 108 ELD-Match needs a twist of 1:8. This data is for Hornady handloads and HornadyPrecision Hunter factory ammo using a 200 yard zero and a 24 barrel. It had a 2.23-inch case length, a .243-inch pointed soft point bullet diameter, and muzzle energy of 2,788J. TheHornady 10th Edition(p231-237 and p317-322) reloading manual was also used as a reference for the history of the cartridges and provided data to compare their size and recoil. It's a good compromise in efficiency (a 105 going 2970fps w/34.8gr of Varget) good barrel life plus way easier on the brass. In addition to their ammo intended for competition shooting, Nosler also recently began offering factory loaded 6mm Creemoor hunting ammunition. The problem is that Hornady, which developed the 6 mm ARC, made a slight alteration to the case length so that it would be compatible with very long 6 mm bullets that have a high BC. Demand for the new cartridge rapidly grew during the ensuing years. bullets. Also Available At: Brownells and Guns.com. If you have any doubt how well Hornady does this look no further than the 6.5 Creedmoor. Case capacity of the 6mm ARC is 34 grains. My take on this is, why opt for 1 when you can have both? I have a rifle being built for me right now, a Badrock but it is going to be late summer before I see it. Specifically, those handloads use a 100gr InterLock with a .405 BCand the factory loads use a 90gr Hornady ELD-X (.409 BC) in .243 Winchester to a 103gr Hornady ELD-X (.512 BC) in 6mm Creedmoor, and a 143gr Hornady ELD-X (.625 BC) in 6.5 Creedmoor. Interestingly, there is a surprisingly good selection of factory loaded 6mm Creedmoor ammunition these days. The sixmm ARC has enough stopping power to take down small game, but it is not ideal for self-defense against larger animals or humans. Your email address will not be published. If you are looking for a versatile round that can be used for both target shooting and self-defense, the sixmm ARC is a good choice. This is reflected in the prices, availability, and variety of factory ammunition and hunting rifles currently in production for each cartridge. Like the saying cutting a 300wm down turns it into a 308win. In this article, Im going to discuss the pros and cons of the 6mm Creedmoor cartridge in detail. For these shots, high shoulder is recommended. F-1 Proof Stag Custom Lightweight AR in 6mm ARC, 6mm Creedmoor rifle for sale - Short Action Customs. 6mm CM is over 200fps faster even pushing the ARC with a more compressed load. Once this unconstitutional law is struck down or repealed, this restriction will be removed. case, being based on the .257 Roberts hull, has slightly more powder capacity than the .243 Win., and it's therefore capable of imparting a bit more velocity. As far as I know I the 6 CM has much more case capacity and higher operating pressures so I'd expect more velocity especially with longer barrels. As is the case with a handful of other newer cartridges, 6mm Creedmoor ammo has been much easier to find than 243 ammo throughout most of 2020 and 2021, even at the worst of the shortage. Compared to 5.56 NATO, the 6mm ARC offers substantially less drop and wind deflection and provides the ability to shoot much more accurately at longer distances. The case volume of the 6mm Creedmoor is on average 51.7gr H2O, with a case length of 48.77mm, and for the 243 Winchester of 53.6gr H2O with a case length of 51.94mm. The average muzzle energy of the 6mm ARC is about 2300 ft-lbs, while the average muzzle energy of the 6.5 Creedmoor is around 2700 ft-lbs. I can't find the weight but I bet it's the one they mention that is only 4lbs 5oz. This is especially trueif youre currently having a tough time finding ammo for other similar cartridges (like 243 Winchester). If youre looking for a round that can do it all, then the ARC is the one you want. You can boost the performance of the 6mm ARC in a bolt action quite easily. The sixmm ARC has enough stopping power to take down small game, but it is not ideal for self-defense against larger animals or humans. There is also talk on a post over on Accurate Shooter forum by a person calling himself gnoble, that he built this or a very similar cartridge back in 2001 already by shortening a 243 Mashburn (I think he meant a 244 Mashburn). The 6mm ARC was designed to match specific DOD requirements while fitting in the AR15 platform. Find the perfect load for your rifle and shoot accurately. However, if you are looking for a round that is specifically designed for self-defense, you may want to consider something else. I think the trick is not just looking at each of those things in isolation, but trying to strike the "right balance" between those competing . Im a Reloader and I have a 6 ARC, though its a gas gun. Makes for a crazy lightweight 6.5 grendel in their Howa carbon stalker Dec 8, 2021 #8 A Anschutz 0 Joined Mar 19, 2017 Messages 137 Location Fairbanks, AK Just playing in GRT, 6ARC would get 2400ish and the 6CM would get 2700ish. Using dramatically less powder, it is believed that the barrel on an 6mm ARC will far outlast a 6mm Creedmoor's. It kicks less and has very similar performance regarding wind drift, which after accuracy and consistency is the biggest issue for long-range shooting. Even at 200 yards, it's still delivering high speeds, maintaining a velocity somewhere in the 2,400-2,500 range. When you use the link above to shop for one of the products, we receive a small commission from the sale, at no extra cost to you. All three cartridges have the same rim .473 diameter and they are all close enough in overall size that they are used in short-action rifles. If we look at the debate of the 6mm Creedmoor vs 6.5 Creedmoor for PRS shooting and competitions, both have their own merits. Required fields are marked *. I only get 2680fps out of my 22" barrel. But when it comes to long range, and standard short actions, the 6mm Creedmoor beats the 6mm ARC quite far. D DocT Joined The fact that this was said on such a knowledgeable forum, with no objection by anybody and the first person to mention that such a reamer has been made before by PT&G was in 2010 on that thread. While the 6mm Creedmoor was very popular among PRS competitors, thats a relatively small market compared to the American shooting population as a whole. Heres how each cartridge compares directly to the others in general terms. August 20, 2020 By Steve Gash. Which it does pretty well within those limitations. A 6.5 Creedmoor barrel typically lasts between 2,000 and 3,000 rounds, while the 6mm Creedmoor experiences serious velocity drops starting between 1,500 and 1,800 rounds. JavaScript is disabled. Like I do with my semi's, rifle & pistol, parts availability, large aftermarket support and readily available reloading components/ammo will need to factor into whatever I decide on. 6 ARC vs 6 CREEDMOOR | Ballistics ComparisonThe 6mm arc was developed by Hornady for use in an AR-15 but can be used for hunting or benchrest shooting mini action bolt rifle. This is "6mm ARC vs the Creedmoors" by Hornady Manufacturing on Vimeo, the home for high quality videos and the people who love them. How does this new 6mm improve on the performance of the 6mm Creedmoor or the 243 ? This law also restricts communications that promote an organization such as ours. The Brass is better than 1/2 Price and easily available. you would be blown away at the number of people that picked the 6XC and the 6 creed. But what does that mean for terminal ballistics? ELD (l.) makes for an excellent long-range target round, while the 103-gr. ELD-X . It also has a very mild recoil thats nearly on par with the exceptionally light shooting .243 Winchester. Even though it has the longest case of the bunch, the .243 Winchester has a 20 degree shoulder, which is not quite as sharp as the 30 degree shoulder shared by the 6mm and 6.5mm Creedmoor cartridges. The biggest advantage of the 6mm ARC is its extremely high ballistic coefficient (BC). I think my buddy said 2700 fps rather than 2750 fps out of a 18" barrel. Mag. The 6mm Creedmoor was also intended for use from the start in semi-automatic rifles like the AR-10 as well as bolt action rifles. By the numbers, the 6mm ARC case head measures 0.440, just 0.005 smaller than a 7.6339 case. For all the reasons mentioned is why I went with a 6x47 Lapua for a bolt gun. If you can not see the tyranny of having a gun ban enforced by men with guns Then you fail to understand why the second amendment was written in the first place. What bullet it takes and stabilizes is a function of the barrel more than the cartridge, with the same barrel specs the .243 would actually stabilize the longer projectile better via its higher velocity. From the ballistic standpoint, the .244/6mm Rem. The sixmm ARC has enough stopping power to take down small game, but it is not ideal for self-defense against larger animals or humans. If youre in the market for a new rifle, youve probably come across the 6mm ARC and 6.5 Creedmoor calibers and are wondering which one is better. My personal 6 Creed is a Remington 700 Stainless Action from a rifle originally chambered in 308 Win, the action was then trued, fitted with a Lothar Walther .243 barrel in 1-7 twist on it with the chamber cut for a 6mm Creedmoor. This is not the case with the .243 Winchester (or other cartridges based on the .308 Winchester like the .260 Rem for that matter). We poled 25 shooters at the range and had 4 rifles built the same. Its release as a commercial round was presaged by a number of successful 6mm wildcats like the 6mm AR based on the Grendel. I know there is detachable mags designed for better feeding the short case. The powder, the case, the primer and case wall thickness are some contributing factors for sure. The Lapua cartridges are for handloaders only, but Hornady offers match-grade 6mm and 6.5 Creedmoor ammunition. Nosler provided the data used to compare the recoil of the .243 Winchester (here). The 6mm Creedmoor or 6Creed as some call it, was a natural evolution as with almost any other 6.5mm Creedmoor that was eventually necked down to 6mm for faster muzzle velocities and lower recoil for PRS style racegun competitions. The 6mm ARC cartridge is a new SAAMI-spec cartridge based on the 6.5 Grendel case necked down for 6mm bullets, with the shoulder moved back 0.030. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. 6.8 SPC. Ruger and Hornady decided to capitalize on growing demand in the United States and began selling factory 6mm Creedmoor ammunition and rifles for the cartridge during 2017. Our Sitemap. Most 243 Win. The 6mm Creedmoor can be seen as the replacement for the .243 Winchester, so all the animals that was generally considered fine to be hunter with it, the 6mm Creedmoor can be used to hunt with just as well. The much newer 6mm Creedmoor is by far the least common. The recoil impulse of the 6.5mm Grendel is also significantly heavier than 5.56x45mm. Comparing 6mm ARC to 6mm CR is is apples and oranges again. All things considered though, the three cartridges are very accurate, flat shooting, and hit hard enough for use on a wide variety of game at practical hunting ranges. It and the 6mm Remington have the horsepower to best the 6mm Creedmoor, but the Creed has the rifling twist, so let's use its ballistics to compare against its parent, the 6.5 Creedmoor. The 6mm Creedmoor has a trajectory thats virtually the same as the .243 Winchester and significantly flatter than the 6.5 Creedmoor inside of 500 yards. However, thats during normal times and, as Im writing this in 2021, were not living in normal times. Proprietary parts other than the float tube so you'll have to have one built if you go this route. 6mm ARC vs 6mm GT vs 6XC vs 6 Creedmoor Panther Hollow 2.85K subscribers Subscribe 213 Share 11K views 1 year ago PLEASE READ.. In general, the bigger the bullet, the better it will perform on game animals. The .220 Swift's effective distance came in at 275 yards. 243 wssm, very accurate, very tough brass, 87 vmax at 3200 from a 22" barrel. At 1,000 yards, the 6mm Creedmoor drifts about a foot more than the 6 . And max velocity can be achieved with stick powders in CM. I had always been told you need a certain length barrel for certain calibers. We have found some 6mm Creedmoor shooters pushing the bullet speeds in excess of 3000 fps to get around 2000 shots out of their barrels, and some have been able to extend that with proper barrel care life letting the 6mm Creedmoor barrel cool between firing strings, and hBN or other coatings on the bullets, or using the Tubb Throat Maintenance System bullets every few hundred shots. The powder capacity isn't even close. So while we cant say for sure how long the new ARC will last, we think it has a good chance of becoming a staple in the world of competitive gaming. In a bolt action The 6 Creedmoor rifle is easier to come by in good rifles. I used the Hornady Ballistic calculator and Shooters Calculatorto compare wind drift, the range each bullet goes subsonic, and recoil for the cartridges. Both Cartridges have real advantages & disadvantages. Available components is why the 6mm ARC makes sense, well that was the theory prior to Covid. Additionally, I recorded an entire podcast episode on this exact subject. Using the 6mm AR as the closest matching cartridge to the 6mm ARC (.441 base diameter, 30 grains H2O case capacity) in QuickLOAD, when limited to 52,000 PSI, the highest 108 grain ELD-M muzzle velocity from a 24" barrel is from 29.6 grains Hodgdon CFE223, yielding 2680 fps (it makes 2820 fps from 31.2 grains at 62,000 PSI). The 6mm ARC produces a larger splash signature that allows shooters to self-spot impacts and make rapid adjustments. 6.5 Grendel. Find Reply Dino11 Member Posts: 350 Threads: 33 Joined: Jul 2020 #2 I shoot 105 Berger hybrids from mr 6br but dont hunt with it to know what damage they do. I have spent a lot of time in this rabbit hole. The 7mm obviously stands []. Offset by a wide selection of available high end 6CM brass. In addition to Hornady, Barnes, Federal, Nosler, and Remington all currently produce 6mm Creedmoor factory ammo. I'd say that for peak performance they do. out of 25 shooters9 picked the 6 creed as the least recoiling round.8 picked the 6XC6 6mm GT2 6mm ARCThe 6mm ARC was built in a Howa action and the 6mm Creed was in a Howa action. Thankfully though, there are many companies now including Hornady, Peterson, Starline and a few more, making 6mm Creedmoor brass cases. Review: Hornady 6mm ARC. This makes it an excellent choice for long-range shooting, as it will maintain its velocity and energy over long distances. So far my "go to" 6GT load is a 112gr Barnes Match Burner at 2900 FPS. THANK YOU. Recoil vs cartridge study over the past year and findings. Great questions! It is more suited for the shorter action rifles like AR-15s and the Howa Mini Action rifles. For those reasons, flat shooting, medium bore, high velocity (up to a point), and mild recoiling cartridges with a long barrel life have a big advantage in these competitions. The 6mm Remington was built with a new factory load of 100 grain and was said to have an exit velocity of 3,190 fps. Unlock the Benefits of Knowing Your Winchester Serial Number, Complete Buyers Guide to the Sig Sauer P228. Other shooters took notice of how well the rifle and cartridge performed during PRS competitions that year and began ordering 6mm Creedmoor rifles from Gardner. Initially to create 6mm Creedmoor brass cases, one would simply neck down high quality 6.5 Creedmoor brass with a good full length sizing die and enough case lube. BR GT Dasher all fine established cartridges but Brass and no factory rifle availability shows there limited appeal. A mild recoil also facilitates with spotting misses and taking a rapid follow up shot both at the range and afield. Even though the two InterLock loads use the exact same bullet, the 6mm Creedmoor does still have an advantage in wind drift over the 243 since it fires that bullet at a faster initial velocity. The cartridges are otherwise identical up to the shoulder and both cartridges have the same SAAMI maximum pressure of 62,000. Heres why: First and foremost, the new ARC is designed to be more durable than its predecessor. The 6mm Creedmoor or 6Creed as some call it, was a natural evolution as with almost any other 6.5mm Creedmoor that was eventually necked down to 6mm for faster muzzle velocities and lower recoil for PRS style racegun competitions. fps Burn % Pressure max 6mm ARC - Alliant Reloder-17 *T 109.3 30.9 2621 98.4 62000psi 6mm Creedmoor - Alliant Reloder-26 *C 102.3 47.8 2837 99.4 62000psi It also has a relatively low muzzle velocity, so it is not as effective at long range as some other calibers. Wind drift is a different story. similar to a .260 Remington) but with a long neck and the proven 30 degree shoulder angle that is seen so often in the top performing accuracy cartridges. Fortunately, there are also plenty of other good 6mm hunting bullets that will work very well in the 6mm Creedmoor. While Snow moved onto other projects, the story of the 6mm Creedmoor didnt end there. To further illustrate that same point, consider the supersonic ranges of the three cartridges. These high velocity, rapidly expanding bullets arent really suitable for big game hunting, but theyre absolutely devastating on varmints and predators. In a 10-mph crosswind the 6mm ARC 108-grain bullet drifts 10.9 inches at 400 yards. Of the three cartridges though, the 6.5 Creedmoor is likely the most popular of the three cartridges, followed by the .243 Winchester. Yes, the ARC is an incredibly powerful round that can take down even the largest animals with ease. You'll need a new barrel, bolt, and mags. The table below compares compares the 3 cartridges using Hornady Precision Hunter ammo along with 2 max handloads for the 243 and 6mm Creedmoor using a 100gr InterLock taken from the Hornady reloading handbook. In general, larger calibers have more recoil than smaller calibers. The bullet diameter is .243, the same as any other .243 or 6mm centerfire cartridge like the 243 Win, 6mm Remington, 6XC, 6GT, 6mm BR and 6mm Dasher. Create and promote branded videos, host live events and webinars, and more. People quickly make jokes about the 6.5 Creedmoor cartridge when they hear a shooter has it, but you never hear anybody joke about the 6mm Creedmoor, as there is no denying the seriousness of a 108gr ELD-M bullet charging down range at 3100+ fps. Aside from having very slight differences in their overall length, the only other difference between the 6mm Creedmoor and the 6.5mm Creedmoor is the fact that they shoot 6mm and 6.5mm bullets (.243 and .264) respectively. Why would a guy opt for the ARC over the Creedmoor in a bolt action? Even so, the 6mm Creedmoor has received a lot of press because its undeniably well designed and offers definite advantages over similar cartridges. Been doing a little more experimenting 6mm ARC Complete Upper 20" SS Barrel and 6mm Reloading EVERYTHING! Ballistics are very similar for the 6mm Creedmoor and .243 Winchester inside 500 yards, but the 6mm Creedmoor is much better suited for longer range shots since it can use those more aerodynamic bullets. The .243 Winchester only has a maximum SAAMI pressure of 60,000. Theres no guarantee what the future may hold, but if I were in the market for a new hunting rifle and wanted something with great ballistics and minimal recoil thats great for deer that I could actually purchase a good rifle and ammo for right now, then Id be very seriously considering getting a rifle in 6mm Creedmoor. Copyright 2023 Big Game Hunting Adventures LLC | All Rights Reserved. As can be seen with the Kudu bull taken at 180 yards late evening with a well place head shot. A large volume of slow burning powder takes more barrel to burn. Team Hornadayis the master, bar none. It would also be nice if it's a platform that allows me to relatively swap barrels on my ownthe actions that can take Savage/Remage barrel nuts is high in my consideration. There are several other factors that contribute to a bullets stopping power. That is not cast in concrete however and many larger CXP3 animal have been taken with 6mm Creedmoors, but usually either at long range with high-shoulder shots, or close range with headshots, but this is not recommended. Another factor to consider is the current state of the competitive gaming scene. I shot a prs match with that setup back in September. For the sake of discussion, why do you believe that the ARC will overtake the Grendel? 100-grain load exiting at 3,100 fps, and the .243 Win. I went with the 6 Creed for mine. Its accuracy and power make it more than capable of taking down even the most elusive prey. Because a real avid shooter loads his own ammo for various reasons. What the 6mm Creedmoor absolutely excels at though, is those same small to medium CXP2 type animals, but at long range, with consistently expanding high-BC match bullets like the Hornady 108gr ELD-M or the Berger 105gr Hybrid Target. They decide that with their own hard-earned money. First you will see the video showing a guy that has hunted hundreds of those sized animals with his 6mm Creedmoor at long range and high shoulder shots. JavaScript is disabled. Cal September 2, 2019 Ammo & Handloading, Brass, Bullets, Load Development, Powder, Primers, What The Pros Use 45. This helps us keep this site going, and does not affect the price you would pay usually in any way whatsoever. So, the Creedmoor has about 17% more energy at the muzzle than the 6mm ARC. Dont underestimate the impact that recoil has on the ability of a person to shoot accurately either. The 6mm Advanced Rifle Cartridge (638mm), or 6mm ARC for short, is a 6 mm (.243) caliber intermediate rifle cartridge introduced by Hornady in 2020, as a low- recoil, high- accuracy long-range cartridge, designed for use in the AR-15 platform at request of a specialized group within the U.S. DoD for its multipurpose combat rifle program.